Google Workplace and price hike policies discussion

System · June 1

This discussion was created from comments split from: Cloudflare being shady?.

giang · June 1

@Mumbly said:

@Joseph said:

@root said:
Just like Google abandoned free services with domains and storage, same will happen with Cloudflare. The problem is how a huge chunk of internet users rely only on Cloudflare, so I guess many will start paying, just like many started paying to Google.

Google never offered free domains. And they still offer free storage.

He means ex-Google Apps/G Suite (personalized emails with own domain, personal workspace, etc.).

At some point, Google discontinued the decade old "always free" (their words, not mine) version of Google Apps/G Suite (now called Google Workspace). However, they announced that existing legacy users could continue using it for free 'forever' (according to their public statement). Then, one day, they announced that they would completely discontinue it, even for legacy users.
Legacy users could have kept their accounts if they paid $5/m or something like that per user, which didn't sound too bad. However, legacy accounts had often been licensed for 20, 50, 100, 500, or more users. Those who had used these accounts for, say, their whole family, would have needed to pay monthly for each individual sub-account/mail/user.

The problem was that many past purchases/play store licenses were tied to those old accounts (play store accounts, purchased apps, purchased music...) so they couldn't be just cancelled. People's paid services became hostages. Pay or everything, even your other paid services tied to the account will be cancelled.
This caused significant public backlash, so Google changed their decision again and allowed legacy users (those who didn't transfer their stuff to paid accounts yet - many did it because of the sudden threat of deletion) to keep their old accounts for private use. For now.
However, these accounts are now more and more limited, they don't get new features, etc. Many would gladly get rid of it, but they can't because their paid services (like decade of purchases from Play store) are tied to those accounts.

I can imagine something similar will happen with Cloudflare's free tier accounts sometime in the future.

I’m still using free legacy Google Workspace, it was free 10 accounts 15GB but after free upgrade now I got 300 free accounts with 30GB each…

Mumbly · June 1

@giang said: I’m still using free legacy Google Workspace, it was free 10 accounts 15GB but after free upgrade now I got 300 free accounts with 30GB each…

What upgrade? There was no such thing as an upgrade for free G Suite accounts (unless there’s cheating that includes old resold Google for Education or Google for Nonprofits accounts, which have bigger number of licenses and 30GB of space each by default).

Since June 27, 2022, there have been only two options for legacy Google Apps/G Suite/Google Workspace accounts:

Convert the account into a paid account.
Identify the account as "for personal use" with downgrade of number of licences to a maximum of 10 users.

https://support.google.com/a/answer/2855120?hl=en

Old legacy accounts converted into "for personal use" accounts are very limited now. They don't receive some new features, etc.
Can you check if you have access to https://one.google.com/

giang · June 1

@Mumbly said:

@giang said: I’m still using free legacy Google Workspace, it was free 10 accounts 15GB but after free upgrade now I got 300 free accounts with 30GB each…

What upgrade? There was no such thing as an upgrade for free G Suite accounts (unless there’s cheating that includes old resold Google for Education or Google for Nonprofits accounts, which have bigger number of licenses and 30GB of space each by default).

Since June 27, 2022, there have been only two options for legacy Google Apps/G Suite/Google Workspace accounts:

Convert the account into a paid account.

Identify the account as "for personal use" with downgrade of number of licences to a maximum of 10 users.

https://support.google.com/a/answer/2855120?hl=en

Old legacy accounts converted into "for personal use" accounts are very limited now. They don't receive some new features, etc.
Can you check if you have access to https://one.google.com/

I was converted from 10 free 15gb G suite legacy for personal use to 300 free 30gb Google Workspace for personal use and it’s still free now.

It was an upgrade to me, because more free account and more free storage lol.

Mumbly · June 1

@giang said:
I was converted from 10 free 15gb G suite legacy for personal use to 300 free 30gb Google Workspace for personal use and it’s still free now.

And how did you do that? To "convert it"?
Something does not add up here. There was no option for a free smaller account for personal use to automatically convert into a bigger account for personal use. There was no such option unless it involved an old Education/Nonprofit organization account.

Furthermore, Google was very strict in 2022. You had to either pay or (that came after public backlash) identify the account as 'for personal use' with a maximum of 10 licenses. There was no other option for old legacy G-suite accounts. The only way to keep a larger number of licenses and 30GB of space was by converting an old education or nonprofit account into an Education Fundamentals workspace account.

My account still shows "91 available, 9 assigned" licenses, but Google was clear ... using more than 10 of them, the account won't be considered "for personal use," which means I will need to pay. I am not trying my luck here.
No matter what, there never existed a free G Suite plan with 30GB space unless it's an old free educational or nonprofit account. Those still have 30GB of space per user.

Edit.
Nevermind. I overlooked your edit/screenshot that says "business starter" and not "G suite legacy". It seems to me like you have a different beast here

ahnlak · June 1

@giang said:

@Mumbly said:

@giang said: I’m still using free legacy Google Workspace, it was free 10 accounts 15GB but after free upgrade now I got 300 free accounts with 30GB each…

What upgrade? There was no such thing as an upgrade for free G Suite accounts (unless there’s cheating that includes old resold Google for Education or Google for Nonprofits accounts, which have bigger number of licenses and 30GB of space each by default).

Since June 27, 2022, there have been only two options for legacy Google Apps/G Suite/Google Workspace accounts:

Convert the account into a paid account.

Identify the account as "for personal use" with downgrade of number of licences to a maximum of 10 users.

https://support.google.com/a/answer/2855120?hl=en

Old legacy accounts converted into "for personal use" accounts are very limited now. They don't receive some new features, etc.
Can you check if you have access to https://one.google.com/

I was converted from 10 free 15gb G suite legacy for personal use to 300 free 30gb Google Workspace for personal use and it’s still free now.

It was an upgrade to me, because more free account and more free storage lol.

That says "Google Workspace Business Starter", which is something they grudging allowed some people to upgrade to for free at one point - although they didn't exactly go out of their way to tell anyone.

Given their track record, there's no way of being sure they're not going to randomly shut that down next week either; I'm much happier having migrated my domains out of there.

Mumbly · June 1

Can you check if you have access to https://one.google.com/

Mumbly · June 1

@giang said:
It was an upgrade to me, because more free account and more free storage lol.

Yeah, seems like different thing. That's mine (check licence "Name")

Scroll down to the bottom of that link https://support.google.com/a/answer/2855120?hl=en where the comparison between those editions is located.

giang · June 1

@Mumbly said:

@giang said:
It was an upgrade to me, because more free account and more free storage lol.

Yeah, seems like different thing. That's mine (check licence "Name")

Because you didn’t upgrade for free when they offered?
I did see similar message in your screenshot, but it was totally free upgrade at the time, 1 or 2 years ago.

I don't have access to one.google.com, it said: You're currently signed in to your Workspace Account. To access Google One, switch to your personal Google Account.

Mumbly · June 1

@giang said: Because you didn’t upgrade for free when they offered?

I didn't have that option. Like said, there were two options. One click to start paying for Google Workspace subscription and another click to convert legacy account into account "for personal use". I picked the second option.

I am not sure how you ended up with "business starter" account for free as that's paid subscription.
As you see your account wasn't converted into "google account for personal use" https://admin.google.com/ac/billing/legacytransition but into usually paid Business starter edition.

In case you're not logged in to see url above:
Google Workspace for personal use
Starting August 22, 2023, the option to self-identify as a personal user and revert to a no-cost subscription is no longer available. If you’ve already identified that you use your account for personal use, no further action is needed at this time. Learn more.

@ahnlak said: Given their track record, there's no way of being sure they're not going to randomly shut that down next week either; I'm much happier having migrated my domains out of there.

I agree, but what did I know 15+ years ago when I started using it on my phone for Android Market (now Google Play - "bringing together Android Market, Google Music, Google Movies, and the Google eBookstore") purchases?
Most, if not all, of my purchased apps are tied to this old account. It's not a problem to migrate domains, emails, or data from gdrive. Even a YouTube channel can be converted/migrated to a regular Google YouTube account i think. But purchases (Play store licenses linked to google account) can't be moved.

Eventually, I may be forced to downsize those 10 licenses to just one, which I use for all those Google Pay purchases and start paying $6 USD per user/month Business Starter plan, even though it's not ideal for me since my mail/space is hosted elsewhere. Alternatively, I could simply forget about all my old purchases, but that isn't an ideal option as long as I use an Android phone either.

giang · June 1

@Mumbly said:

@giang said: Because you didn’t upgrade for free when they offered?

I didn't have that option. Like said, there were two options. One click to start paying for Google Workspace subscription and another click to convert legacy account into account "for personal use". I picked the second option.

I am not sure how you ended up with "business starter" account for free as that's paid subscription.
As you see your account wasn't converted into "google account for personal use" https://admin.google.com/ac/billing/legacytransition but into usually paid Business starter edition.

In case you're not logged in to see url above:
Google Workspace for personal use
Starting August 22, 2023, the option to self-identify as a personal user and revert to a no-cost subscription is no longer available. If you’ve already identified that you use your account for personal use, no further action is needed at this time. Learn more.

As I said, I upgraded or converted (whatever) from Gsuite Legacy to Google Workspace for free, and I just followed the email Google sent to remind, I just followed it.

And yes, I remember I chose "for personal use" too.

Mumbly · June 1

@giang said: And yes, I remember I chose "for personal use" too.

Yeah, but mine account is still free G Suite legacy "for personal use," while you somehow ended up with Google Workspace "Business Starter" (which is usually a paid account).
I needed to go to https://admin.google.com/ac/billing/legacytransition and opt out of the transition to the paid Workspace subscription to keep free G Suite legacy "for personal use," account. It's just mistery to me how you ended up with free Business account

That was the mail I got:

Dear Administrator,

We previously notified you that you would need to upgrade from the G Suite legacy free edition to Google Workspace by June 1, 2022 or your account would be automatically upgraded. However, we've recently updated our timeline for the transition and you now have until June 27, 2022 to take action.

What do I need to do?
For businesses, the G Suite legacy free edition will no longer be available after June 27, 2022 (updated from June 1, 2022). We recommend you upgrade now to a Google Workspace subscription that meets your needs. Upgrading from your G Suite legacy free edition to Google Workspace will only take you a few short steps and is not disruptive to your end-users.

When you've identified your preferred subscription follow these steps:

Go to your Admin console.
Select your new subscription offering.
Enter your billing information.
If you take no action by June 27, 2022, we’ll begin to upgrade your organization seamlessly to a new Google Workspace subscription. The new subscription will be based on what you currently use with your G Suite legacy free edition.

In addition to recent innovations like smart canvas, meetings in documents, and dedicated Spaces to help organize people, topics and projects, Google Workspace includes more storage, increased security, 24/7 support, and more. To complete the transition and avoid account suspension, switch now and enter your billing details in your Admin Console before August 1, 2022. You’ll have limited time discount options to support you in this transition.

If you’re an individual or family using your account for non-commercial purposes, you can continue using the G Suite legacy free edition and opt out of the transition to Workspace in the Google Admin console before June 27, 2022.

If no action is taken, we’ll begin upgrading your organization seamlessly to a new Google Workspace subscription starting June 27, 2022. To complete your upgrade and avoid account suspension, you'll need to set up Google Workspace billing before August 1, 2022.

In case that you need to reactivate your account, you’ll need to log into the Admin console and enter a valid form of payment.

Qualifying educational institutions and nonprofits have the option to migrate to Google Workspace for Education Fundamentals or Workspace for Nonprofits without service disruption.

Timeline Summary
Date Action
Before June 27, 2022 Upgrade to a new Google Workspace subscription or opt out of the transition.
Before August 1, 2022 Complete your upgrade by setting your Google Workspace billing.
FAQs
Visit the help center for information on the G Suite legacy free edition to Google Workspace transition.

We’re here to help
If you have questions or need assistance, please Contact Google Workspace support. When you call or submit your support case, use reference issue number 205265.... If you have trouble accessing your administrator account, please refer to instructions to reset your administrator password.

Thanks for choosing Google Workspace.

– The Google Workspace Team

This is what I (and most people) got:

For individuals and families that used your account for non-commercial purposes, you can identify as a personal user and revert to a no-cost subscription by clicking the button below (requires a super administrator account).

This is what you have:

For businesses, the G Suite legacy free edition will no longer be available after June 27, 2022. Your account will be automatically transitioned to a paid Google Workspace subscription where we continue to deliver new capabilities to help businesses transform the way they work.

Unlock premium features with Google Workspace
By upgrading to Google Workspace, you'll unlock 24/7 support and access to other premium collaboration and security features, based on the edition you choose.

Business Starter

Double the storage—30 GB of Drive storage pooled to securely keep over 100 different file types.

99.9% uptime guarantee—Depend on Google Workspace services being available when you need them.

Increased security—Protect devices and data with fundamental endpoint management and audit logs.

Add-on subscriptions—Add more subscriptions, such as adding Google Voice to get a dedicated business phone number.

So, in case Google doesn't screw you over at some point (but they could screw over all non-paid G Suite users anyway), you somehow ended up with a free "Workspace Business" deal that's better than the old G Suite legacy for personal use.

benz · June 1

@Mumbly said: It's just mistery to me how you ended up with free Business account

That's the migration path google offered?
I also went from a free 10 user gsuite to a free 300 user "Google Workspace Business Starter".
https://lowendspirit.com/discussion/3715/g-suite-free-edition-no-longer-available-starting-july-1-2022/

Mumbly · June 1

It seems like mistery is solved
You both missed the deadline for converting your account to "G Suite legacy for personal use" and somehow ended up with a usually paid Business account for free.

https://www.reddit.com/r/gsuitelegacymigration/comments/wgo40d/google_workspace_business_starter_no_cost_free/

Now keep your fingers crossed that they won't start charging you or cancel it as unpaid one day.

Mumbly · June 1

@Fritz this could be the case, yeah.

@bikegremlin sorry for hijacking your thread. It's partially connected to the CF as proof of how corporations can change their stance on free services over time, but then we went too much into detail.

benz · June 1

@Mumbly said: You both missed the deadline

If I recall correctly, I just did what their support told me in order to keep a free account.
Seems like that was the right decision, I rather wonder that they keep carrying on gsuite accounts until today.

Did you add billing details to your account back then? That's what I intended to avoid, successfully.

giang · June 1

@Mumbly said:
It seems like mistery is solved
You both missed the deadline for converting your account to "G Suite legacy for personal use" and somehow ended up with a usually paid Business account for free.

https://www.reddit.com/r/gsuitelegacymigration/comments/wgo40d/google_workspace_business_starter_no_cost_free/

Now keep your fingers crossed that they won't start charging you or cancel it as unpaid one day.

No, I didn't miss, I converted before the deadline.

I followed extractly what Google said in the email, converted from Gsuite legacy to Google Workspace, I also remember they required to input billing information (But in the process, they said they wouldn't charge, just for verification).

I just asked few IT friends, they got the same account with me. (Google Business Starter 300 accounts for free). The account said it's free and I don't think they would charge a free service, but I hope they won't discontinue it somedays.

There was no glitch I think. This was what Google offered at the time?

Mumbly · June 1

@benz said:
Did you add billing details to your account back then? That's what I intended to avoid, successfully.

No, of course not as it's not Workspace Business account.

@giang said: I followed extractly what Google said in the email, converted from Gsuite legacy to Google Workspace

Exactly, that's what I have been trying to tell you from the beginning.
Publicly announced ways to keep a free "personal G Suite account" did not include an upgrade to Google Workspace. Quite the opposite, they gave us two options:

To upgrade the account to Google Workspace Business Edition and start paying.
To opt-out from the upgrading and keep the account as a free personal G Suite account.

You upgraded to Workspace Business, but for some strange reason, they allowed you to keep it for free. At least for now.

giang · June 1

@Mumbly said:

@benz said:
Did you add billing details to your account back then? That's what I intended to avoid, successfully.

No, of course not as it's not Workspace Business account.

@giang said: I followed extractly what Google said in the email, converted from Gsuite legacy to Google Workspace

Exactly, that's what I have been trying to tell you from the beginning.
Publicly announced ways to keep a free "personal G Suite account" did not include an upgrade to Google Workspace. Quite the opposite, they gave us two options:

To upgrade the account to Google Workspace Business Edition and start paying.

To opt-out from upgrading and keep the account as a free personal G Suite account.

You upgraded to Workspace Business, but for some strange reason, they allowed you to keep it for free. At least for now.

They said they would convert to free Google Workspace, that's why I did follow them and converted, and it is still free as they said in the email and notification.

There is no magic or glitch here. They gave me what they offered when I converted.

My friends got same free Google Workspace too.

I remember that I also opted out to keep Gsuite Legacy free, but after the deadline, Google sent email and also showed a small notification at the top that they would convert / upgrade to Google Workspace for free, then I followed their instructions and got it.

Mumbly · June 1

@giang said: I remember that I also opted out to keep Gsuite Legacy free, but after the deadline, Google sent email and also showed a small notification at the top that they would convert / upgrade to Google Workspace for free, then I followed their instructions and got it.

Alright then.

I wish you good luck with your account, and the same for me with mine. I would really hate to start paying for Google Workspace just so I can keep the Google Play apps I’ve already paid for.
It's annoying enough that Android offers to backup some of my phone stuff, like contact numbers, to Google One (https://one.google.com/), and then doesn't let me sign in. I assume you don't have access to that either?

Jab · June 1

There are really two options

a) You upgraded to paid Workspace (but there was X months free first) and then later Google changed theirs mind and you ended with free Workspace, because "downgrading (more like rollback?)" to Free Legacy Edition of G Suite for personal use wasn't possible (or costed a lot of money/resources for G)
b) This is region specific, local laws?
EDIT, there is one more?
c) You had more than 10 users[1] [I remember deleting some to be < 10] in your admin account (limit in Free Legacy Edition of G Suite for personal use) so Google gave you free Workspace so you wouldn't break theirs system?

[1] However seems like Google docs lie - the limit seems to be 100 rather than 10 for Legacy https://i.imgur.com/d5AR2Wz.png

@Mumbly this thing that some of Google new and older services does not work with G Suite is fucking funny - do they really think I will upgrade just to log into YT or something? :-D

AuroraZero · June 1

No dawg in this fight, I just want to challenge @System to a boxing match!!!

giang · June 2

@Mumbly said:

@giang said: I remember that I also opted out to keep Gsuite Legacy free, but after the deadline, Google sent email and also showed a small notification at the top that they would convert / upgrade to Google Workspace for free, then I followed their instructions and got it.

Alright then.

I wish you good luck with your account, and the same for me with mine. I would really hate to start paying for Google Workspace just so I can keep the Google Play apps I’ve already paid for.
It's annoying enough that Android offers to backup some of my phone stuff, like contact numbers, to Google One (https://one.google.com/), and then doesn't let me sign in. I assume you don't have access to that either?

I didn't buy Google One so I can't access to it. I'm good with free 15 gb for email, now 30gb free is more than enough.

Joseph · June 2

I got Google Workspace free when it first came out 15+ years ago. At the time I requested (when signing up they asked you how many you need), and was granted, license for 750 users. I still have 750 available licenses for users with the free legacy edition today.

Mumbly · June 2

@giang said: I didn't buy Google One

Regular Google accounts (i.e., "Gmail accounts") have Google One access enabled by default. 15GB storage you mentioned is now managed through Google One.
Therefore, if I use a legacy G suite account instead of regular Google account as my main android phone account, some features (as example backing up phone, managing storage...) that work with an ordinary Google account will not function with old free G suite account. I can't backup my device via Google One https://support.google.com/googleone/answer/9149304 because I have no access.

Unlike with a ordinary google account, I am not able to log in to the Google One interface. Or at least that's how it is with my legacy G Suite account, so I asked if your Workspace account that is a bit different than mine can log into google one or also doesn't have access to the https://one.google.com/

giang · June 2

I don’t have access to one.google.com from Workspace account, although I got 30gb free for Gmail.

Joseph · June 4

Is their a difference in how storage is shared between all mailboxes in the same Workspace account between the free version and the paid version?

Google Workplace and price hike policies discussion

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